My boyfriend of nearly 2 years has been a gamer for all his life. Or at least that's what he told me. He has been playing various games since he was young, and various MMORPGs such as RO and currently he is playing WoW. He has been playing the latter even before he met me, and he used to be infatuated with a girl he met in there. They are in still in contact, but I believe they are currently just friends, plus the girl has also quit the game recently.
One thing which bothers me is that recently he has been playing more and more. There was one weekend when it was a public holiday (we were currently in a LDR and can only meet once a week) and I was really happy because it's a chance for us to spend more time together. I talked to him over the phone about this and was immediately aware that he was not happy about it. When I asked him why, he said it is because he has scheduled raids with his guildmates and he can't afford to not go. I said this is only once in a while opportunity that he can get to spend more time with me, and he said that I am being too clingy. I was hurt but in the end I let him do what he wanted.
And just yesterday when I talked to him about this again he said currently more and more people are spending more time in the game because there is some kind of special event that can allow them to get rare items if they go on specific instances or raids. I asked him when does he have to go for the raid, he said it is usually midnite until nearly 1am. I am concerned as he needs to wake up to go to work everyday at around 6am and I believe a 5 hour sleep is not enough, and especially since he might need to work the night shift at times. I have talked to him many times regarding this but he said I don't understand him because I don't play the game myself.
I used to be a gamer but in a different type of MMORPG. I used to be so addicted and I lost my ex due to the game, because I would rather spend time with the "friends" I have made inside the game, organize events for them to enjoy rather than spending time with my ex. I only got the wake-up call when my result (I was still studying at that time) went downhill and I even failed one of my core subjects. I have quit playing the game ever since and when I told him about my experience, he said it is not the same, it is easy to quit the game I played but it is not that easy to quit WoW as all his real life friends are in there and they NEED him. He said he can't just give up and forsake them in this way.
So right now he is scheduling everything around the game, when he reaches home the first thing he will do is log into the game and start joining the raid, and sometimes he doesn't even have time to have dinner. He will call me for a while halfway through, but I am afraid it might get worse and he will not even call me soon. Sometimes even when we are on the phone I will sense that he is not paying attention as he will be chatting with some of his guildmates online, and when I asked him if it is possible to concentrate on our conversation, he will sound really unhappy and say that I am unable to find something else to do by myself...
We have been together for a while yet there is no plan for the future (no concrete plan at the moment) and whenever I asked him, he will just say that he wishes he is earning a million a month so that he can retire and just spend the whole day playing the game...or that he wishes he can get a job as the gamemaster in the game...He still goes to work regularly now and I have been trying to get him not to take leave just because he needs to attend certain raids or things like that, but I am not sure if this will get worse...
So is my SO really addicted to WoW or I am reading too much into things? ???
If your boyfriend would rather spend time in the game than spend time with people he loves, it's quite likely he is addicted. It's sad, but at least you are seeing this before you are committed to marriage and children. Read some of the stories from the wives on this forum and think about what you want your future to look like. Good luck to you.
"Small service is true service while it lasts. Of humblest friends, bright creature! scorn not one
The daisy, by the shadow that it casts,
Protects the lingering dewdrop from the sun." -------William Wordsworth
But he is not totally pushing all of us off yet...for example, he still spent time talking with me (on the phone) every night (but he might be distracted after a while) and on one of the weekends he still goes out with me. He is saying that he needs some personal space to himself to do the stuff he likes as well... Plus he also takes time to go out with the friends he has made in the game, but the time is getting lesser, he is spending more and more of his free time on the computer now to play the game... I am trying to be fair, I understand gaming can be as much as hobby as reading and listening to music and playing tennis, but I think what I am ****ed off about is how inflexible the game is about. As in we would have to coordinate our schedule to fit the raiding schedule he has in game. For example he will try to push back our talk time until after he has completed an instance or a raid with his guild members...
Addiction, like most things in life, is not black and white. I believe that there are degrees of addiction. For example, with myself, my addiction was to regular video games but, on average, I did not play them that many hours per day (probably only about 4 or 5) compared to other people. However, it was still a significant problem since it was coupled with other issues like my procrastinating using other means. In your boyfriend's case, compared to other stories that I have read here, he does not seem to be as badly addicted as some other people are. However, it does seem to be that he is getting somewhat worse and you should be concerned about that, especially considering your own personal past. I realize that you are trying to be fair and have an open mind, but I agree that is not appropriate to plan your life around a game rather than the other way around. Before you make any future plans, this is an issue that I believe that you need to resolve with him. I wish you luck in being able to work things out with your SO in terms of the time that you spend together and him playing his game.
- John O.
[em]Carpe Diem![/em] (Seize the Day!)
Thanks so much for your reply... And it is true that addiction is not black and white. That's the reason I find it so hard to talk to him about this, because when I bring it up, he will just say he is not as badly addicted and I do not need to worry. Currently he is playing around 3 to 4 hours every night, but I told him he should not play more than that because he would need to work the next day. I have talked to him before that it is ridiculous to plan your life around a game, but he said that's the way the game is, and I don't understand because I am not in it. He doesn't understand that I have gone through the same situation before and I have lost so much to it that I am trying to prevent him from going into similar situation as mine in the past. Thanks for the luck, I think I will need lots of them...
Hi Moonfairy (what a pretty screen name!)~ I think you know already that your SO has got a big problem. If you guys get married, you'll have that problem, too (it works that way with marriage, all his problems become yours and vice-versa). Playing 3 or 4 hours a night, blowing you off, fantasizing about devoting his entire life to the game, turning down social obligations, taking off work to play, and refusing to negotiate or discuss it with you are all signs that something is really wrong and it won't start getting better anytime soon. There is nothing special about WoW that makes him more obligated, or makes his commitments more special, or should make his playing time more sacrosanct, than any other game. His statements to the effect that your prior game-playing experience is irrelevant, because WoW is different, are wrong. "You don't understand my alcoholism because you were addicted to vodka and I'm a Scotch guy myself." Nah, you have great insights into the addiction process and he's just trying to weasel out by pretending you don't know what you're talking about. I am sure there are lots of things you admire and like about your SO, but, as with any other addiction, those likeable traits and features are going to fade away until all that's left is a clicking monster who will do anything to save and maintain his little kingdom. If he isn't "all about" WoW now, he will be in six months or a year, and then that's that much more of your own free time and youth squandered on a losing proposition. You received great advice to read posts from other gaming widows and widowers on this board. Once you look at them, you'll know what to do. Sincerely, Jane in CT
Thanks for the reply guys...:) I talked to him yesterday and seems that he is pretty open to discussing the issue. I said too much gaming time is not good for him, and I asked him, won't he feel that he is missing out something out there if he spends so much time cooped up in the room playing all day? He said he does sometimes...but he knows what he is doing and will try to control the habit. He said there might be times when he would want to take time off work to play, but just occasional leave here and there and not one long stretch of leave just because he wants to attend the events and raids. He asked what would I do to him if he started taking long leave just because he wants to play...I said I would leave him alone to suffer the consequences and will not even help him out financially. I think he was quite shocked when I told him this because previously when he was jobless for a few months, I was ever-ready to help him out. I told him I would help him if he lost his job due to "natural" and legitimate reasons, not because he kept taking and faking leave to play the game...
Good for you Moonfairy. You may begin to see that we can carry the message but not the addict. Good for you!
"There is little difference in people, but that little difference makes a big difference. The little difference is attitude. The big difference is whether it is positive or negative." --W. Clement Stone
He asked what would I do to him if he started taking long leave just because he wants to play...
i think after he suggested this you should definitely know the answer to your question. this is what makes these problems so dangerous. look how we are willing to jeopardize bills,love,and sweet memories for a game. ive even heard of some people trying to get government assistance just to have more game time.
He said he is just joking only...he just wants to see my reaction when he mentioned that to me...sometimes I really do not know when is he joking and when is he being serious...but I guess I will wait and see if he really deteriorates until he reaches that kind of level. But I have made it clear to him that I will not tolerate this type of behavior and that I will not continue to support him if he doesn't have a proper job by himself. So I hope this gets the message across...
I wish you strength. We threatened our son countless times and removed the computer temporarily countless times until we finally understood that he could not regulate himself. This may be a process both of you need to go through to see if your SO can.
Thanks... Lately he has been swamped at work so I am hoping his work will take his mind of the game. He didn't get to play yesterday and I can tell he is a bit unhappy about it...
i know that feeling too well. i had to get my game time in to function normally. if i didnt get to play i would be grumpy or anxious until my next session. about my last comment i think he may be testing you to see your reaction. theres a good chance its in the back of his mind and he probably fantasizes about it.
Yea, I know he fantasized about it, he has mentioned it to me before. But fantasizing is not the same as actually doing it, so as long he never puts his "fantasy" into action, I will lay low and not take any drastic measure for the time being. I also think it will be unfair to him if I keep pestering him if he is just playing during his free time. I have told him what my reaction will be if neglects everything else just because he wans to play the game. So I guess unless he wants something drastic to happen, he would know it is not appropriate to do what he was thinking about...
that's good moonfairy i like your approach. my wife would get verbal after the results weren't favoring her needs and i think it made me zone in even more. keeping back and being suggestive is a very good way to let him know how you feel yet still let him feel he has control. keep in mind though that they say over 2 hours is excessive. most of us here cannot stay under that so we have chosen to quit all together due to lack of self control. i hope this all works out for you guys. Scott
Yea, I tried not to nag at him because I know he dislikes that. So all in all, I am actually being very considerate to him, I just hope he won't take it for granted :| Well, that game cannot be played in less than 2 hours, because of the raid and stuff, and he can't quit halfway without feeling like he is forsaking his guild members... He told me that he won't be playing tonight but is going out to meet his friends instead! But those friends are from the game...is it counted? ???
I hate to sound so pessimistic about all this, but bear in mind that gamers game. That's what they do. They strategize and plot and plan ingame and... out. Including in their relationships, specifically as they relate to "outsiders" trying to put limits on their playing. My best guess about the "I want to devote my life to WoW... just kidding!" stuff is that it's a try-on. If you went for it, he would, too... but he retained the escape hatch of being able to say it was all just in fun. I get the impression from your posts that you are perhaps a young adult, as is your SO? Here is some good news for you: there are lots and lots of smart, capable, caring young men out there who don't have addiction issues. Whether you believe it or not, you don't deserve to be hooked up with someone who's carrying this load of problems and, most importantly, you cannot solve them for him. Nobody can rescue anybody else. If I were your mom - and I know I'm not, ok? - I'd ask you why you were spending all this time trying to salvage a relationship with someone who has major, major difficulties around a video game. If you were to get married, believe me, the impetus for him to change (however strong or weak that might be) will completely evaporate. Now at least you have the leverage of being able to threaten to leave or end the relationship if he doesn't change; once you are married and especially if you have children, you'll be trapped but good. I am not saying that nobody should ever get involved with anyone with addictive propensities of any kind. But it certainly does sound from your posts as if (a) your SO has a serious attachment to WoW - whether you call that an addiction or anything else; (b) you have serious problems with the way he approaches his life and yours because of his WoW playing; and (c) he isn't remotely interested in changing or even trying to take an honest look at what he's doing or why. Even if you don't feel you can or want to leave him over this, at least do yourself the favor of not becoming further committed or involved (and keep your eyes open for that nice guy who thinks Windows are for looking through, okay?). Jane in CT
I am in my mid twenties, he is in his late twenties. That's why I am a bit worried as there don't seem to be any commitment to getting to the next level (getting engaged or married) on his side yet. Sure whenever I asked him if he is serious about me and would like to go further, he said yes, he has some plans but since we are both still in a LDR it is hard to plan everything properly yet. He also has a bad habit of not being able to save his money, he will just spend everything he earns on some piece of technology or to upgrade his computer to make it easier for him to play WoW...I am worried about this but he kept saying that he will start saving when the time comes...but when will that be? We have discussed this together and we agreed that starting from next year we would need to start saving up for the future but I am afraid it might be really hard to control his spending, and I don't to come across as a b**** who told him he can't buy this and that just because I want the money to go into the bank account... My parents do worry about me being with him, particularly when they know how much time he spent on the game, and also because it seems there doesn't look like any immediate plans for our future...they have given me the same advice as you, Jane...but because of attachment I have formed, it is really hard to leave even when sometimes I have thought about it...You can say that he might be addicted to the game, while I am "addicted" to him...in a way, I am emotionally dependent on him, whatever he does or say can affect my mood and that's why I try to give in most of the time to prevent a quarrel, because it will definitely affect me badly the next day... Yesterday I was really disappointed because he went out with his guild friends and didn't give me a call as always at night...I called him and he was enjoying himself with his friends at that time, but after that he sent me a message to apologize for not calling me...I still felt sad and disappointed as he has never missed to call me even once all these time...I hate to feel this way T_T
Good for you, sounds like you've drawn a pretty clear line in the sand. Whats so powerful about that is it forces the gamer to face the consequences for his actions directly. A good dose of reality can do wonders for a fantasy habit. Many addicts have someone supporting them, 'enabling' them to keep living in their chosen irresponsible way. I know I did in my addiction (thanks mom! :D). Some figure out a way to have both, but I was never one of them. I always wanted to have it all, all gaming, no work! Haha, well that doesn't work when you have to feed yourself. Plus I can't stand thinking about a game all day during my 'real life'. It depresses me so much. And that's pretty much where my head goes as soon as I play... Can't live in two worlds. Well you're the most important part of this equation. Do whats good for you, can't help someone who doesn't want to be helped.
I agree with a lot of what Jane says. If you are looking for commitment and this person in his late twenties isn't ready, why are you waiting. Actually, it is concerning that you are so dependent on him for feeling good. That reallly does set you up for a good deal of hurt. You might want to think deeply about what you want for you and whther this person is in a place to provide it. I think he has to break from the guild friends--are these real life friends. One thing I noticed is that my daughter doesn't talk to her guild friends anymore nor does she hang out with the real life friends who played WoW. Instead she has reconnected with pre WoW friens and is again doing different activities including spending time with us--her family.
I guess I have seen this type of thing play out to much, so I know most of the possible endings. Most of them are not good. The only thing that seems to actually work is making an ultimatum and sticking to it. I am not going to tell you what the ultimatum is only you know what you want out of the relationship. Things will just get worse at the current staus quo. I wish you luck and strength.
Where's Laura? We need some good info on co-dependency here. I know that's one of the issues I deal with with my son. If he's up, I'm up. As he spirals, so do I. Time to get off the merry-go-round....
Yes, those are his real life friends. That's what make it so difficult for him to not hang out with them... I guess things do take turn for a better this weekend, he realized that he made a mistake for not calling me on Friday night plus he also hanged out with some people in his guild who have actually been married. Those people actually gave him some good advice lolz, plus they sound pretty mature...they said they need to spend time with their other halves and only play when they have free time or when their SO is busy at work, etc. Personally I don't see anything wrong with that. But I did tell him some of the stories which I have read over here, about how the husband is not helping out the wives at home because of the game, etc and he asked what would happen if he became that way. I said if that's the case, divorce is on the line for sure. I think he was quite shocked but I said I am serious and I will stick to my words.
Hmm, I wish members here can be more optimistic about our situation rather than thinking everything will end up in a sad way? :| Of course, that is one possible ending, but it is not easy to just leave in a relationship. This guy means a lot to me and I would like to help him as much as could, and I am looking for ways to help me to help him...not just telling me to leave him straight away...
Well then, have you asked him to visit our site here? Perhaps he would take the time away from gaming to read the posts and you two together could talk about some of them. Perhaps the two of you could sit at the computer together and attend a meeting? There are positive results within these pages, but most do not even involve moderating gameplay, they involve the stopping of gameplay all together. It is so sad that the 6-12% (rough estimate) of WoW players cannot moderate their playing time and are hooked just like they are on heroin or meth. Have you prayed about this situation? Have you prayed together with your SO?
"There is little difference in people, but that little difference makes a big difference. The little difference is attitude. The big difference is whether it is positive or negative." --W. Clement Stone
Yes, I have prayed about this situation...I haven't prayed with him yet because you see, he doesn't see his gaming as a problem. He said he goes to work, spends time with his friends outside of the game, spends time with me, with his family...but he still needs to play because that is his interest and his hobby! Like for example, I will feel pretty weird if someone asks me to stop reading just because it is addictive...I just told him he needs to monitor his time carefully for now...I can't get him to quit because he will just give me the same reasoning that he is not addicted to WoW all over again...So unless I can get something which totally proves he is addicted to the game to the point of affecting something else important in his life, I can't ask him to stop playing altogether...
I don't want to keep on beating a dead horse here, but YOU are never going to "get" your SO to see that he has a problem.A There is never going to be anything that you can show him, or say to him, or any other way you can "prove" to him that he has a problem if he doesn't see that he has a problem.A If he thinks his life is working fine and he's just spending time doing a harmless activity (one that he really, really, really enjoys), you are powerless.A We suggest that you ask him to visit the site, or pray with him, to raise his awareness about compulsive gaming and its potential consequences.A But there is absolutely nothing that you... or any of us... can do to convince him that he has a problem. The only person that any of us even arguably has any control over is ourself.A We are doing wonderfully if we can even control that person, much less anybody else.A That is why we ask you to evaluate the impact that your SO's gaming is having on you.A Only you can decide if what you're getting from the relationship is worth what you're giving.A We can also give you some ideas about what may lie ahead for you if you -- with eyes wide open now -- decide to make a commitment to him.A It may be that what the two of you have together is so special, so wonderful, that even if he played 18 hours a day, you'd still love him just the same, you'd still want to make a life together, you'd still choose to bring kids into the world with him.A Aha! you say, he's not playing 18 hours a day now, though.A This is true.A However... he's already told you that his vision of a perfect life would consist of playing all day, every day.A He's asked you (albeit in a joking way) if you'd support him if he lost his job due to gaming.A His gaming has caused you to question whether he values you or his game more.A By now you've read many posts and stories about folks whose playing escalated way beyond their ability to manage life in any significant way, so you know this possibility is out there, and you've expressed fear that this may be in your SO's future.A Bottom line, you know there is at least a chance that some day you may be dealing with a full-blown, 24/7, addicted gamer.A We can also tell you that many, many posters on this board who are dealing with addicted gamers have gone through the following recurriing cycle: cirisis brought on by gaming => serious discussion with gamer, threats to leave => promises by gamer to reform and moderate play => gamer returns to gaming and attempts to moderate => gamer is ultimately unsuccessful at moderating play due to addiction => play escalates back to or beyond prior levels, psychic attachment to game grows stronger => crisis!A You may be at some point in this cycle right now with your SO or you may not, again, none of us can judge that for you, we can only share our experiences and you can make your own decision about what to do based on your unique situation. I do want to share with you that it is extremely important to choose someone for your life partner whom you can rely upon for the storms that life will inevitably visit upon you. It may not look like it from where you're sitting right now, when you are young and have your health and (presumably) no major tragedies have occurred as yet, but this stage of life it is the easiest time you'll have in your relationship. Later on, there will be kids - who are wonderful but bring major stresses of their own - your parents will grow old, his parents will grow old, people will be unemployed, people will have health problems, life will bring all sorts of unexpected problems and none of us escapes without at least a few major bumps and bruises. It's not to say there is only difficulty and sadness to look forward to... there will be much joy as well... but it is so, so important to choose someone who will really be a partner, who will be "there" and a full partner in the relationship, not presenting major problems of his own, or retreating into fantasyland when things get tough. In closing, I can only reiterate that you are not fated to, and certainly do not deserve to, be yoked to someone whom you need to rescue or save (which you cannot do in any event).A You deserve to have a special man in your life who puts you first, who does not have major issues, who will be stable and dependable and worth making a life with.A If you think you can get through all this with your SO... or if you think the package is so attractive you'll take it regardless, then go with God.A A Go with God either way! Jane
moonfairy, thank you for being so responsive on your posts it seems to be creating a friendship between us. i agree with alot of the others in some ways but in some ways not. for instance i do agree he has a problem that he will not fess up to. i dont agree that leaving him is a good thing for you. you do seem very attached to him and thats great. i think he will need a person like you to look out for him. nothing worth great value is free. working through this and supporting eachother mentally will make you guys stronger. im sure the finacial cituation will get better im 27 and barely learning to save . if he can limit his time playing it is teaching him a good lesson on comprimise which im sure you guys will have to do this with other situations as well. one good thing i wanted to point out is the calling you thing when he goes out. thats great and im sure he loves you because many people dont even do that for eachother. as long as he trys to make effort and listens to your comprimises im sure things will be fine. i mean if he didnt care or ignored this then maybe id say run for it. hes trying and its not easy to limit your time on something you really feel pationate about. all i know is if you are willing to take these chances then he must be a really good guy. lets just hope gaming doesnt get the best of him like it did some of us.
Hi Jane, Appreciate your long post...I understand what you mean. Right now I am trying to keep my eyes open wide to see if he is relapsing into a worse state...I have told him that I have a limit that I will tolerate and if he goes beyond that limit, it is goodbye for sure. So far he has not approached the limit yet...
I believe that compromise is very important in a relationship. I can't just leave him because he likes to game, and go and find someone else, because that someone else, although not addicted to gaming, might have some other imperfections. He might be addicted to something else or have some other types of weaknesses. So I ask myself: Do I leave every single time when I spot a weakness in my other half? Or do I stay and try to help them to get over it?
Do I leave every single time when I spot a weakness in my other half? Or do I stay and try to help them to get over it?
well this im sure you must answer yourself but im sure in most cases youll get a friend out of it or will at least be remembered for what you tried to do :) keep in mind though if it does hurt you over and over or he becomes numb to your feelings id bail out. you can only do so much ya know? hope you guys keep workin through it.. scott
It depends on you and what you are willing to tolerate. No-one is perfect but I am pretty sure there are some things that most of us won't tolerate. I have had a long marriage but dealing with our child's addiction has put more strain on it than anything in our decades together. However, we are working it out.
[size=14] I guess what I would ask yourself is... Am I helping your other half get over the "weakness" or are you enabling it...? & how much is it going to "cost" you emotionally to try... These are questions only you can answer for yourself. [/size]
" ... don't question it just go" "... where the body goes the mind will follow"
.
Borrowed from "Desire to Stop"
How can I be an optimist with a paragraph like this or the one you wrote b4? Changing people is hard if not impossible especially if they they don't want to change and don't see a problem. Sorry, all I see in this one is pessimism. John had it right when he said the positive outcomes were only seen when people stopped playing the game. Until he realizes there is a problem and starts doing something about it there is not real hope for you. You know what you need to do but are holding back. Are you holding back for the right reasons?
You know this this Ancientone, but there is ALWAYS hope! Without HOPE our message at OLGA would be empty words. There is always hope! I edited this message because i saw you post hope on another thread... Good for you & Thanks.
"There is little difference in people, but that little difference makes a big difference. The little difference is attitude. The big difference is whether it is positive or negative." --W. Clement Stone
These few days he has been really busy at work (to the extent of staying until 9 or 10pm in the office sometimes) and he hasn't been playing for a few days at least. He seems really excited that things are picking up for him in his workplace (might be getting a promotion soon, so hence the increased responsibility lately)...we talked about our future as well and he said he is working hard so that he will be able to provide a good life for both me and him. I don't think there will come a time when he will stop playing completely...it is like me and reading. I am an avid reader and sometimes I do read until 2 or 3am if I found a good book to curl up with. I don't see that as a problem as long as I still do my other stuff at work and still spend time with my loved ones. Same goes with him. I guess I am not going to be unfair and stop him from indulging in his interest as long as he knows how to manage his time like what he has been doing lately...
glad to hear things are goin well lately. i think you guys might be ok afterall. at 1st i saw potential for disaster but if he holds control of the urges the game posesses then all will be well. not everyone has issues controlling their game time. hope all works out good and you guys get a promotion.